Quotation For Overhaul Of 5i Flat - Is $60k Reasonable?

[morningstar 0]

Hi experts,

Been a slient reader on this forum but really hope to have your help here.

We have looked around for IDs/contractors the past few mths and have finally shortlisted two of them.

One of the contractors provided us the quote of 60K (list below) and we tried to negotiate for a reduction of a $4-5K esp on the carpentry works (seem quite costly).

However, my contractor's response was that my budget is too tight and they rather forego my biz. This is really discouraging to us cos it means that we may have to up our budget or go through the whole cycle of looking for other contractors.

Are we asking for too much discount? We are thinking of removing all carpentry works on the guest/study/entertainment room to reduce costs as its only me and my husband now. My questions are:

1) Is there any areas in the quotation that I can reduce costs?

2) Any general renovation costs that are not captured in the quotation below? (trying to minimise VO)

Would greatly appreciate your comments. Thanks!

Item Description Amt (S$)

Project Management

* Design Conceptualization, Space Planning, Colour Scheme

and Materials Proposal for the Whole House, Site Inspection

and Whole House Cleaning.

1 Demolishing Works

To supply labour and materials to hack and dismantle the existing

following items: -

a) Living/dining/ entertainment room floor tiles and skirting

b) 3 bedrooms floor tiles and skirting

c) Kitchen wall and floor tiles

d) 2 bathrooms floor and wall tiles

e) Existing kitchen cabinet

f) Existing door and window frame between kitchen and service 2,380.00

yard

g) Service yard floor tiles

h) Wall panel between living and kitchen area

i) Wall panel at master bedroom

j) New door opening at common bathroom

k) Existing false ceiling and cornices

l) Existing wardrobe at 3 bedrooms

m 2nos.of toilet bowl

n) 2nos.of wash basin

o) 1no.of rubbish chute

Sub - Total (S$): 2,380.00

2 Masonry Works

To supply labour and materials to

a) Lay 600 x 600mm imported China homogenous floor tiles at 3,850.00

proposed storeroom, living/dining room and passageway to

bedrooms c/w skirting (tiles up to $3.00 range)

b) Lay imported ceramic/homogenous wall tiles up to ceiling height 2,500.00

for 2 bathrooms exclude border and décor tiles (tiles up to

$2.50 range)

c) Lay imported homogenous floor tiles at 2 bathrooms c/w 840.00

waterproofing membrane treatment (tiles up to $3.00 range)

d) Lay imported 600 x 600mm homogenous floor tiles at proposed 480.00

wet kitchen area c/w waterproofing membrane treatment (tiles

up to $3.00 range)

e) Lay imported 600 x 600mm homogenous floor tiles at service 480.00

yard area c/w waterproofing membrane treatment (tiles up to

$3.00 range)

f) Construct 2" thick shower kerb at 2 bathrooms clad with tiles F.O.C.

g) Construct 2" thick cement mortar base for fridge and washing 160.00

machine clad with tiles

h) Construct 2" thick cement mortar base for kitchen cabinet clad 180.00

with verticle tiles

i) Install 1no.of stainless steel flat rubbish chute 180.00

j) Seal up existing common bathroom entrance using HDB 250.00

approved 63mm thick hollow block c/w cement plaster

k) Erect common bathroom wall using HDB approved 63mm 480.00

thick hollow block c/w cement plaster

l) Lay cement plaster for proposed wet kitchen and sevice yard 200.00

wall

m) Raise up existing kitchen floor to level up with living room floor 300.00

using HDB approved extruded polystrene foam (EPF)

n) Patch up, make good area after hacking F.O.C.

o) Lay cement screeding to 3 bedrooms and proposed 750.00

entertainment room

p) Construct 14ft L hollow block wall up to ceiling for master toilet 640.00

entrance, store & kitchen entrance.

q) Construct L shape kitchen cabinet base at dry kitchen 150.00

Sub - Total (S$): 11,440.00

3 Carpentry Works

To supply labour and materials to

a) Construct 3ft designed low height shoe cabinet cum storage 450.00

at proposed foyer area using solid plywood with selected

laminate finishing

b) Construct 9ft designed full height feature wall c/w cushion and 2,000.00

tinted mirror **** room area using solid plywood with

selected laminate finishing

c) Construct 9ft designed suspended TV console **** room 1,260.00

area using solid plywood with selected laminate finishing

d) Construct 12½ft x 5ft designed 4" raise up platform **** 1,000.00

room window area

e) Construct 13ft designed full height book cabinet at proposed 3,120.00

study room area using solid plywood with selected laminate

finishing

f) Construct 2nos. of 8ft L-shape designed study desk at 2,400.00

proposed study room area using solid plywood with selected

laminate finishing

g) Construct 6ft designed full height sliding wardrobe at proposed 1,500.00

guest room area using solid plywood with selected laminate

finishing

h) Construct 4ft designed full height book cabinet at proposed 960.00

entertainment room area using solid plywood with selected

laminate finishing

i) Construct 16ft designed L-shape sliding wardrobe at porposed 4,000.00

master bedroom room area using solid plywood with selected

laminate finishing

l) Construct 5ft designed suspended underneath vanity cabinet 900.00

c/w pop out mirror at master bathroom area using solid

plywood with selected laminate finishing

m) Construct 5ft x 3ft designed island counter at proposed dry 900.00

kitchen area using solid plywood with selected laminate finishing

n) Construct 34ft designed Top & Bottom kitchen cabinet c/w 4,080.00

set of drawer, PVC hard edging, 'Blum' system soft closing for

all doors, stainlees steel dish rack and shelving using solid

plywood with selected laminate finishing

Sub - Total (S$): 22,570.00

4 Solid Surface Material Works

To supply labour and materials to

a) Install 14ft selected solid surface material kitchen counter top 980.00

c/w profile and backsplash

b) Install 8ft L-shape selected solid surface material island 750.00

counter top c/w integrated wash basin, profile and backsplash

c) Install 5ft selected solid surface material vanity counter top 350.00

at master bathroom c/w profile and backsplash

5 Partition Works

To supply labour and materials to

a) Construct partition false wall at proposed master bedroom 750.00

sliding wardrobe area

b) Construct partition false wall between proposed wet & dry 200.00

kitchen area

c) Construct 2ft partition false wall at propposed guest room area 100.00

d) Construct 5ft low height parttion false wall between master

bedroom and proposed master bathroom area 120.00

e) Box up of exposed PVC big pipe with master board & lay wall 800.00

tiles at 2 toilets

6 False Ceiling/ L-Box Works

To supply labour and materials to

a) L-box/false ceiling/cove lighting **** and passageway to 800.00

bedrooms

b) False ceiling at proposed dry kitchen area 350.00

c) False ceiling at proposed study room area 380.00

d) L-box/false ceiling at proposed guest room area 330.00

e) False ceiling at proposed entertainment room area 350.00

f) False ceiling/cove lighting at master bedroom area 600.00

g) False ceiling at proposed walk-in wardrobe area 200.00

h) False ceiling at proposed wet kitchen area 180.00

i) False ceiling at service yard area 150.00

j) False ceiling at common bathroom area 130.00

k) False ceiling at master bathroom area 100.00

7 Aluminum Works

To supply labour and materials to

a) Install anodized aluminum sliding window for whole house 3,550.00

c/w normal tinted glass (does not include top hung window)

(up to 4ft high)(include yrad area)

b) Install 2nos.of anodized aluminum adjustable lourve window at 550.00

2 bathrooms c/w laminated glass (laminated glass or wired

mesh glass)

Sub - Total (S$): 11,720.00

8 Laminate Flooring Material Works

To supply labour and materials to lay laminate flooring material to

3 bedrooms and proposed entertainment room area c/w skirting 2,600.00

and whole life warranty against manufacturers' defects.

(Ace, Power Dekor, Vista)

9 Glass/Mirror/Shower Screen Works

To supply labour and materials to

a) Install 10mm thick clear glass top hung sliding door between 780.00

proposed wet and dry area area (7ft high)

b) Install 10mm thick frameless clear glass swing door c/w 450.00

standard handle at proposed entertainment room area

c) Install 10mm thick frameless frosted glass swing door c/w 550.00

standard handle at master bathroom area

d) Install 10mm thick frameless tempered clear glass swing door 450.00

shower screen c/w standard handle at common bathroom (up

to 6ft high)

e) Install 10mm thick tempered clear glass sliding door shower 580.00

screen at master bathroom (up to 6ft high)

f) Install 12ft(L) 8mm thick coloured glass backing between Top & 600.00

Bottom kitchen cabinet area

g) Install 4ft x 5ft 10mm thick clear glass fixed panel at master 300.00

bathroom area

h) Install 4ft x 5ft 10mm thick clear glass fixed panel at foyer area 300.00

10 Plumbing Works

To supply labour and materials to

a) Lay new cold water pipes for whole house 680.00

b) Lay 2nos.of hot water pipes for 2 bathrooms shower area 160.00

c) Labour to install 2nos.of shower mixer tap c/w shower set 100.00

d) Labour to install 2nos.of sit toilet bowl 220.00

e) Labour to install 2nos.of wash basin c/w drainage system 200.00

f) Labour to install 1no.of central tank heater c/w heater wire 100.00

g) Labour to install 1no.of washing machine tap c/w in/outlet 80.00

system

h) Labour to install 2nos.of kitchen sink c/w drainage system 240.00

i) Labour to install 2nos.of spray jet c/w mini-valve at 2 80.00

bathrooms

j) Labour to install 2 sets of toilet accessories F.O.C.

* Install rain shower additional $80.

Sub - Total (S$): 8,470.00

11 Door Works

To supply labour and materials to

a) Install 4nos.of solid nyatoh wooden door for 3 bedrooms and 1,120.00

storeroom c/w standard lockset

b) Install 4nos.of wooden frame for 3 bedrooms and storeroom 800.00

c) Install 1no. of 'BesGlas' Ezi door c/w acrylic panel at common 300.00

bathroom area

d) Supply & install 4ft L X 7ft H solid design main door 650.00

e) Supply & install 4ft L X 7ft H wrought iron main gate 500.00

13 Painting Works

To supply labour and materials to paint whole house using 1,650.00

ICI/Nippon emulsion paint include dry/wet kitchen wall, service

yard wall and all exposed piping c/w 1 under coat. (max. 8 colours

including white)

14 Plastering Works

To supply labour and materials to plaster whole house wall and 2,580.00

ceiling area c/w angle guard. (include dry/wet kitchen area)

15 Other Works

To supply labour and materials to

a) Apply HDB permit F.O.C.

b) Lay corrugated paper protection during renovation period F.O.C.

c) Acid wash and general cleaning upon completion F.O.C.

d) Labour to install of hood & hob and oven F.O.C.

e) Haulage, provide sand and hoisting of materials to site 1,200.00

f) Clearing of whole house debris.

Sub - Total (S$): 8,800.00

Total (S$): 63,380.00

Less Special Discount (S$): 3,000.00

Grand - Total (S$): 60,380.00

[JeanL 0]

While scrutinizing cost is important, choosing a good ID or contractor is equally important as well. We did an overhaul of our 5-room flat, signed the contract with Aranus, who gave us a very good price and promised the heaven. But as the saying goes, you pay peanuts, you get monkeys. No coordination and bad workmanship are what we get. And rectification is something that sometimes cannot be done, and we are forced to swallow. Asked yourself if these are things that you want to live with. When you pay more, you see the good results, at least you see the value and that money is well spent.

[neubie 2]

in my opinion, the discount is too little...

also, whatever customized carpentry is going to cost a bomb... take out unnecessary items, do what is needed and not what is wanted. from what i see, electrical wiring is not yet inside....

worst come to worst, KIV this quote and look for other contractors/ID. a contractor/ID should have the "no project is too big/small to handle" principle. if the shortlisted contractor feels that he does not earn much from this project, it's time to look elsewhere...i'm sure there will be one that satisfies ur requirements.

Edited September 9, 2010 by neubie

[morningstar 0]

Hi JeanL,

Thanks very much for ur advice. We hv filtered down our search to this contractor cos he is well recommended by friends and his co received positive reviews in this forum. We have visited one of his completed projects and the workmanship is acceptable. So far, we also communicate pretty well with him. So the only outstanding issue is the budget. As newly weds having our first home, there's really a lot of expenses to take care of and so we are trying to squeeze our budget as much as possible. Do you mind sharing how much you paid for ur reno?

Hi neubie,

Thanks for affirming our decision to cut our budget by reducing carpentry works. Though we feel that they'll make the home look more complete, but they are really wants rather than needs as you rightly says so. At the worst case, we are going to remove all the carpentry work for all rooms (except built in wardrobe for MBR) and the tv console, feature wall in the living. Then we will slowly acquire furniture as time goes by.

Anyway, how much more discount do u think we're able to ask without "scaring" our contractor away?

Any other comments from the experts here? Thanks!

[JeanL 0]

Hi JeanL,

Thanks very much for ur advice. We hv filtered down our search to this contractor cos he is well recommended by friends and his co received positive reviews in this forum. We have visited one of his completed projects and the workmanship is acceptable. So far, we also communicate pretty well with him. So the only outstanding issue is the budget. As newly weds having our first home, there's really a lot of expenses to take care of and so we are trying to squeeze our budget as much as possible. Do you mind sharing how much you paid for ur reno?

Hi neubie,

Thanks for affirming our decision to cut our budget by reducing carpentry works. Though we feel that they'll make the home look more complete, but they are really wants rather than needs as you rightly says so. At the worst case, we are going to remove all the carpentry work for all rooms (except built in wardrobe for MBR) and the tv console, feature wall in the living. Then we will slowly acquire furniture as time goes by.

Anyway, how much more discount do u think we're able to ask without "scaring" our contractor away?

Any other comments from the experts here? Thanks!

We paid slightly less than 40K. Rip out all finishes. Hack kitchen wall. This quote however exclude the cost of kitchen cabinets and wardrobes. We got Closet Design to do these works, very good workmanship and service. It also exclude the cost of marble materials for our living / dining.

[chronograph 0]

Yo bro, u could work within your budget. Take out the wants and keep the needs to reduce the total sum. Frankly, can't comment much on the quote, but i do felt that the masonry is reasonable but the rest is a little on the steep side compare to my time. Cost might have risen over the years, you should know better when comparing quotes.

60k is not a small sum, to many people it is considered quite a big amount. U r the customer here, I definitely cannot stand the tone of you contractor. 60k not $$? I will ask him go fly kite, and look else where for a more sincere and willing contractor that will listen to your problem.

[darth vader 0]

hi morning star, with that budget of urs, may i suggest u go to intradesign and lok for angeline or dave. like u, i'm in midst of my reno which is completing soon. running through ur list, i believe dave / angeline will be able to provide u with better service and design. no harm giving them a try. there r many projects done by them in reno t-blog, u might wanna give they a try.

p.s: again, i must reiterate the fact that i have no vested nterested of any kind for the firms/shops/company/watever jazz that i recommend.

[Brownzukini 0]

brownzukini

Hi ...i m kinda new in renotalk but have been around reading all ur articles.... bro ..i suggest u go around and ask for more quotations .....some reno contractors might be slightly cheaper and dat doesnt mean that they got no .. 60K is a lot of $$ and i m sure its more than enuff .........

[morningstar 0]

We paid slightly less than 40K. Rip out all finishes. Hack kitchen wall. This quote however exclude the cost of kitchen cabinets and wardrobes. We got Closet Design to do these works, very good workmanship and service. It also exclude the cost of marble materials for our living / dining.

Hi JeanL,

Thanks for your recommendation of Closet Design. We will check on that for our wardrobes but I'm sure it will not be cheaper though workmanship should be better

[morningstar 0]

Yo bro, u could work within your budget. Take out the wants and keep the needs to reduce the total sum. Frankly, can't comment much on the quote, but i do felt that the masonry is reasonable but the rest is a little on the steep side compare to my time. Cost might have risen over the years, you should know better when comparing quotes.

60k is not a small sum, to many people it is considered quite a big amount. U r the customer here, I definitely cannot stand the tone of you contractor. 60k not $$? I will ask him go fly kite, and look else where for a more sincere and willing contractor that will listen to your problem.

Hi Chronograph,

Thanks for your kind words. We were wondering whether our budget is too low for contractors and $60K is certainly not small sum to us. And after adding on aircon, electrical wirings and other furnishing, it would at least come to another $15K. So its really very siong for us. Maybe we will go source for some recommended contractors in this forum and do more comparisons before deciding.

[morningstar 0]

hi morning star, with that budget of urs, may i suggest u go to intradesign and lok for angeline or dave. like u, i'm in midst of my reno which is completing soon. running through ur list, i believe dave / angeline will be able to provide u with better service and design. no harm giving them a try. there r many projects done by them in reno t-blog, u might wanna give they a try.

p.s: again, i must reiterate the fact that i have no vested nterested of any kind for the firms/shops/company/watever jazz that i recommend.

Hi darth vader,

After your post, I have read up on intradesign and saw the many good reviews. Do you think he could work within my budget? Does it help if I mention your post when we contact Dave? Thanks!

Edited September 12, 2010 by morningstar

[morningstar 0]

brownzukini

Hi ...i m kinda new in renotalk but have been around reading all ur articles.... bro ..i suggest u go around and ask for more quotations .....some reno contractors might be slightly cheaper and dat doesnt mean that they got no .. 60K is a lot of $$ and i m sure its more than enuff .........

Hi Brownzukini,

Thanks. I will go around to look for quotations. But actually we are pretty anxious to start the reno. Cos we actually waited very long for the flat (signed the OTP since Feb this year) but due to various reasons, we only got our keys in Aug. So we hope to start our reno asap. This whole contractor-sourcing exercise is really tiring.

[Brownzukini 0]

Hei Morning star ...

yeah agree with you .....very very exciting and i understand if u r anxious .but very tedious and tiring...but its still worth it to be a bit patient and get the right contractor....

Its just that .... if i were u...i will never take that company which said to you that they might as well not take ur business (of 60k) coz its not enough.

They are definitely rude...tactless.... not smart enough to attract you to their company but instead, giving you all d reasons to not choose them...

Anyway ...when you are with other companies ....tell them that your budget is around ( always tell them lesser) 48/50K maybe ?? you will be surprised that it might just be enough.....oh ya one more thing...what comes highly recommended by ur friends might just not work for you.....

P/S : i m shifting to 5 rm also ...with 60k ....hmmmmm my house will look like hotel liao.....confirm no problem with companies

cheers ...

[duan 0]

wow 60k for 5i!!! maybe you might want to approach Iz. you can read up his service here. http://www.renotalk.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=28452

gd luck for your reno

[sff 0]

Mine also 5i. only keep bedroom floor. hack and throw the rest. plaster kitchen walls. built-in kitchen cabinets and 3 bedroom wardrobes. Abt 30k.

You might like to save on carpentry. U have quite a bit there. Also you have lots of false ceiling, so lightings would definitely cost quite a lot. going to do downlights for rooms as well? Consider cost of each light point and to install light.