Reno @my Simei 4a Resale Flat

[hcbing 0]

I think CASE or RADAC should start being more active in consumer education ... Or may have some regulations for contractors in using a standard renovation contract. Currently, developers are regulated by the Housing Developer Act and when you buy any developments ( > 4 units), they will always use the standard contract terms which cannot be changed without approval. Similarly, HDB has implemented the standard OTP forms for resale. Maybe should have a standard renovation contract that will protect the consumers and have fair contract terms for the contractors.

RADAC and CASE do have the recommended contract template although it's not actually enforced to be mandatory. I do agree that it's better to standardize so as to protect everyone's interest. blueocean, you've quoted a good example on the standard OTP forms by HDB. I would have imagined what a mess it would be without that in place these days.

[fencer 0]

My technical officer's 1st inspection checklist practically had everything listed about the original condition before completion date. Try ask

Did they give u a copy? or can give? dun tink is confidential right? i'll ask her on this when she calls.. Thanks huh..

[fencer 0]

I think CASE or RADAC should start being more active in consumer education ... Or may have some regulations for contractors in using a standard renovation contract. Currently, developers are regulated by the Housing Developer Act and when you buy any developments ( > 4 units), they will always use the standard contract terms which cannot be changed without approval. Similarly, HDB has implemented the standard OTP forms for resale. Maybe should have a standard renovation contract that will protect the consumers and have fair contract terms for the contractors.

Mayb there was not enuf noise from the public on errant contractors/ID.. so they dun see a need to act..

That is why those who had problem shld speak out.. but of coz contractors can change company name etc.. but unless they can change their names in the IC also loh.. HA..

[hcbing 0]

Did they give u a copy? or can give? dun tink is confidential right? i'll ask her on this when she calls.. Thanks huh..

Nope, I wasn't allowed a copy of the inspection checklist. For flat owners, you do have the standard HDB defects checklist though.

[fencer 0]

RADAC and CASE do have the recommended contract template although it's not actually enforced to be mandatory. I do agree that it's better to standardize so as to protect everyone's interest. blueocean, you've quoted a good example on the standard OTP forms by HDB. I would have imagined what a mess it would be without that in place these days.

The standard OTP forms came up either is coz of public feedbacks or HDB side had a **** of a problem on the OTP, so some1 up there initiated a major change.

Years to come if there are enuf feedbacks from publc, likely a mandatory standard form would be imposed..

Meantime.. well.. contractor/ID is the king... but what choice would consumers have in regards to this.

Hope to meet a good and responsible contractor/ID.. of coz be so during the whole course of reno.. not just starting when it is nec, to secure a written contract or skip boat when trouble blooms.

[fencer 0]

Nope, I wasn't allowed a copy of the inspection checklist. For flat owners, you do have the standard HDB defects checklist though.

ok.. Thanks.. i'll go take a look..

[blueocean 0]

That's why doing renovation with someone is always a "leap of faith" and crossing fingers & toes. You can do all your homework (check references of contractor, do bankruptcy/credit/ litigation search, friends referral etc) but it is still a risk One can mitigate the risk with a good contract. I wonder if any insurer would do a homeowner renovation policy - to provide insurance cover for bad works, contractor absconding ... hahha => i think it is uninsurable or insurable with too high a premiium !

If doing renovation works for a flat is tough. Imagine ... rebuilding a house. Imagine all the possible things that can happen ! It would be a nightmare wouldnt it I have seen a case whereby the owner was re-building a house and one of the workers fell and died. The owner wanted to house to be demolished again and rebuild ... and it became complicated as the contractor was not obliged to do that

The standard OTP forms came up either is coz of public feedbacks or HDB side had a **** of a problem on the OTP, so some1 up there initiated a major change.

Years to come if there are enuf feedbacks from publc, likely a mandatory standard form would be imposed..

Meantime.. well.. contractor/ID is the king... but what choice would consumers have in regards to this.

Hope to meet a good and responsible contractor/ID.. of coz be so during the whole course of reno.. not just starting when it is nec, to secure a written contract or skip boat when trouble blooms.

[baby81984 1]

Yoohoo.. talked.. things moved 10%..

At 1 point when things heat up during conversation w my bro-in-law.. Henry said Spore is very small loh (to my bro-in-law).. Hmm.. wanna drink kopi together?

Broken tile won't be replaced. Coz canot be seen, hard to change, is acceptable, place would be dirty, may damage other things..

Window.. won't be changed.. checked and slope is within tolerance limit... no leak now, got 3 years warranty.. is nice coz no gap betwn window/grill..

End story, i nd to call up HDB myself to ask abt the fireproof door. If need to change to fire-proof door, i'm in deeper ****.. e.g can the door frame take the weight of fireproof door? if need replace, need hack frame, tiles etc etc..

I'll keep a small sum for the window and cracked tile.. would seek advice from other ppl..

oh so basically u met up and nothing was rectified? warranty no use one mah...so easy to siam or delay attending to your works. Afterall u are on bad terms with henry, do you think he will help on your warranty?

hmm..how come the topic of fire-proof door come so late? but anyway hdb will check meh?

[fencer 0]

That's why doing renovation with someone is always a "leap of faith" and crossing fingers & toes. You can do all your homework (check references of contractor, do bankruptcy/credit/ litigation search, friends referral etc) but it is still a risk One can mitigate the risk with a good contract. I wonder if any insurer would do a homeowner renovation policy - to provide insurance cover for bad works, contractor absconding ... hahha => i think it is uninsurable or insurable with too high a premiium !

If doing renovation works for a flat is tough. Imagine ... rebuilding a house. Imagine all the possible things that can happen ! It would be a nightmare wouldnt it I have seen a case whereby the owner was re-building a house and one of the workers fell and died. The owner wanted to house to be demolished again and rebuild ... and it became complicated as the contractor was not obliged to do that

That is very true.. is really cross your fingers and hope for the best..

Mayb if some1 is so distressed over reno and killed himself.. it became a national news and ministers are involved?

Ha.. that is sure serious.. imagine after builing the hse all the way up and discover pipe is not connected below.. Ha.. contractors fault? the piping guys? the guy who pour cement? owner no check?

[fencer 0]

oh so basically u met up and nothing was rectified? warranty no use one mah...so easy to siam or delay attending to your works. Afterall u are on bad terms with henry, do you think he will help on your warranty?

hmm..how come the topic of fire-proof door come so late? but anyway hdb will check meh?

Yup.. basically is that..

Hmm.. 1st pl.. if anything goes wrong with the pipes, tiles.. would i want to call Henry up since there is warranty?

Is a risk loh.. maybe done sui sui and swift.. mayb drag and became worse and i need pay others to come do.. Yes Simon.. Mayb only.. no say Henry would do that.. Ha.. joking lah..

I'll decid when the times comes bah.. scali nothing happen? a crane crash down on my mater bedroom? Ha.. can reno FOC loh..

Coz is my bro-in-law 1st qn when coming to my unit and i told him i changed the main door also. "Does your HDB require fire-proof for your particular unit?".. Stumped.. Ha.. require and proposed to hv is diff huh..

HDB would not come check if your windows is using the rivet (or something..) that is mandatory mah.. Ha.. after you changed window lah.. even if they come check and say why no hv, who is the person to answer?

They come only if something happened.. by that time (mayb after warranty).. who would die 1st? like blueocean said.. most things happen in the house is owner's responsibility, irregardless if you know or not.

Edited May 19, 2010 by fencer

[blueocean 0]

for re-build of house, it becomes even more complicated also as need to get a TOP certificate before you can move in ... if building inspectors are not happy, the renovation nightmare continues. I'm not sure if you have read about this temple that build some 4-5 storey building, TOP granted but unable to get CSC as the contractors/architects that did it didnt build to fire safety regulations ... fire doors etc So although the building is there .. its a white elephant

if crane crash down on your master bedroom .. that sounds unlikely but if it really did, standard HDB insurance only covers the building itself and excludes the content and renovation cost then if want to go after the crane company for damages, also depends on whether it is big or small company ... and whether they are still financially solvent ... then got to file another civil suit ? scary thought ......

what are the remaining things you have to do before you can move in ?

Yup.. basically is that..

I'll decid when the times comes bah.. scali nothing happen? a crane crash down on my mater bedroom? Ha.. can reno FOC loh..

Edited May 19, 2010 by blueocean

[fencer 0]

for re-build of house, it becomes even more complicated also as need to get a TOP certificate before you can move in ... if building inspectors are not happy, the renovation nightmare continues. I'm not sure if you have read about this temple that build some 4-5 storey building, TOP granted but unable to get CSC as the contractors/architects that did it didnt build to fire safety regulations ... fire doors etc So although the building is there .. its a white elephant

if crane crash down on your master bedroom .. that sounds unlikely but if it really did, standard HDB insurance only covers the building itself and excludes the content and renovation cost then if want to go after the crane company for damages, also depends on whether it is big or small company ... and whether they are still financially solvent ... then got to file another civil suit ? scary thought ......

what are the remaining things you have to do before you can move in ?

Didn't read abt it in detail. SO cannot use the building?

Ohh.. ok.. then nd to touch alot of wood liao.. Ha..

I need to move in by end of May.. irregardless whatever is outstanding..

Hmm.. major is the window..

And the unlikely need for fire-proof door.. The rest i DIY these 2 weekends and cont DIY after i move in..

if unlikelyhood that i really need fire-proof door, then xxxxxxxx and no Simon, i'm not blaming Henry on this..

[blueocean 0]

Does the window still leak ? But at least the major things are done up alreadie ...

Anyway, can just slowly DIY the rest of the stuff after you move in .....

You still need to arrange for inspection of the new electrical wiring ?

Didn't read abt it in detail. SO cannot use the building?

Ohh.. ok.. then nd to touch alot of wood liao.. Ha..

I need to move in by end of May.. irregardless whatever is outstanding..

Hmm.. major is the window..

And the unlikely need for fire-proof door.. The rest i DIY these 2 weekends and cont DIY after i move in..

if unlikelyhood that i really need fire-proof door, then xxxxxxxx and no Simon, i'm not blaming Henry on this..

[fencer 0]

Does the window still leak ? But at least the major things are done up alreadie ...

Anyway, can just slowly DIY the rest of the stuff after you move in .....

You still need to arrange for inspection of the new electrical wiring ?

Not at the moment but i really dun know the lifespan of the silicion seal on the rivet.

True loh.. so i trying to fininish up all the DIY these 2 weeks.. hope lah...

Do i need to? If arrange and fail, then how huh?

btw, i called liang to come over to put trunking for the loose wire in the box up. But he won't be free in short time.. bo bian.. need to wait for him to drop by my pl...

Is there any forms that needs to be submitted to me when reno is finished? windows?

There's a form from the aircon installation that states the installer is BCA certified and i aknowledge.. then send to HDB tam branch leh...

[reuben82 0]

Hi Fencer,

Sorry to K-Po here. I just grab out my HDB first appointment letter which titled "First Appointment of Sale & Purchase of Flat" and found out on 4th clause, it is stated when the HDB TO to do the inspection. And the next clause is even more interesting. I will type it out here

"The seller must regularis/remove any unauthorised renovation works found in the resale flat before the completion of the resale transaction. As a buyer, you are purchasing the flat on a caveat amptar basis which means that it is your responsibility to check the condition of the resale flat and satisfy yourself that all renovation works carried out by the seller are authorised and comply with the requirements imposed by HDB or other competent authorities. The buyer will also be responsible for any irregularity, including any unauthorised renovation works carried out by the seller in the resale flat, which maybe subsequently be discovered. The buyer is advised to engage a Qualified person at his own expense to help him in the checking."

So, I think it is a MUST a buyer to attend this inspection. I believe alot of people will overlook this as I did but luckily, I got a good agent who remind me on this. He told me this is the GOLDEN CHANCE for you to fire back the seller on all the things you are not happy with! hahaha.....So, I went to this inspection, complaining this and complaining that, and the TO just put a note there which he think my complains are valid as well. Well, I think to play safe, it is always good to ask some one qualified to do this inspection with you as well like what HDB advised in clause 5!