Retrospectrum Meets Modernisation!

[cannotisit 0]

actually i agree with yowetan, u paid for someone to coordinate the work and be the contact point of the project, if he's always uncontactable and u need to take time off from work to supervise the reno, u might as well look for workers yourself to do it.

we all know uncle soon is a great guy who put a lot of pride in his work but his group of workers is another story.

i was also considering to look for uncle soon to reno my new place but after a few of the t-blogs, notice he could be uncontactable or forgetful abt details some of the time. i think all the workload is too taxing for him. i have decided to source for other contractors.

[cannotisit 0]

aubrey,

i know your deadline is next week, must be real tense now. hope the kitchen cabinets and other carpentary works will come out as u visualise. abt the electricity, seems it's FOC, change everything.

[adrian_john 1]

Aubrey, I read about your frustrations and really hope things are looking up on your end. I guess when time is the essence, its frustrating to encounter any hiccups. Hang in there man. You know, ironic or as unreal as it may seem, I read before somewhere that apart from the death of a loved one, moving house and renovation is actually the 2nd most stressful and draining event in one's life?

Go easy on the Coke Zero and fast food! You still need to stay healthy to enjoy the wonderful new place.

[pinkpetter 0]

haha and Adrian makes the air easier to breathe!

And I think he's right Aubrey... go easy on the fast food... get rest when you can...

[aubrey 0]

RAR! i am back in the office. sad to say my job is based on timelines and more timelines so i am no stranger to closing deadlines etc, and this relates to my house. currently i dont have the luxury of time to craft a response to yowetan so that has to wait. i will explain my personal choice in choosing uncle as my contractor and what follows after.

also, just a note, do take some time to read and digest what i said earlier with regards to the flux i was in. i was not pin pointing jason nor uncle for the electrical works gone topsy turvy. turns out that the guy i spoke to was not Ah Tan. it was his worker who told me to get my own switches. when Ah Tan heard it, he immediately apologized to me. I was ok, i understand, no hard feelings. So the problem does not lie directly with Jason nor Uncle, but more of the sub-con. Which i feel may be a prevalent issue with other companies.

Live and let live. I want to eat O Chang Kee chicken wing! But I don't drink coke nor soft drinks, just those canned teas (lemon, peach etc etc)

updates in a bit.

[ivy 0]

yowetan,

6 years ago, I paid $30K for a 5room reno with an ID firm who is suppose to give me design and project manager. The design was crap and the project manager was not effective. my $30k only give me kitchen cabinet with postform top, ceramic tiles for living/dinging/bedrooms/alter/half ht shoe cabinet and 1 wardrobe. Toilets nv do cos no budget.

With the $30K i paid, I get 40% of hollow floor tiles when i knock on them. ID refuse to change and took down my kitchen cabinet doors becos I refuse to pay them without them rectifying the floors. We end up in lawyer office.

So paying for ID will never guarantee you anything, I second Pet, whoever dare stand out and say engage ID sure no problem you can shoot me. All renos bound to have some ups, some downs. Even the best ID will have a little miscomm here and there.

I am one of the latest who join the bandwagon of engaging Uncle. I have my fair share of miss calls and skipped appointments. I am willing to work with uncle cos all IDs that I approached no one comes near to the pricing that uncle quoted me. There were all around the $45-$50K range. When I engage uncle, I also have to realign my expectations. Not easy to find cheap and good things around. Beggars can't be chooser for my case. But I guess, becos I am willing to realign my expectations becos of the good pricing I get, I am naturally more tolerant.

I already know uncle will skip appointments and be late for appointments and have miss call BEFORE i engage him, so why complain after work start? It's not as if he super on right at the beginning like some ID and once sign on dotted line wahh attitude change. Uncle is consistent in his funny behaviour. He is truer than true. To me, he is kind and willing to help.

Even if I engage an ID, as a house owner, it will still be our responsibility to go up to check and make sure the work doen is correct. Will anyone really leave the whole project to ID 100% and just shake leg at home? I know I won't. The ID interpretation and standard of work maybe different from their customers. The customers are the ones that know what they want best.

Let's say these, people who go with uncle do it with eyes wide open

Uncle's sincerity and showing his true self to us is what I like.

Edited May 21, 2009 by ivy

[ivy 0]

RAR! i am back in the office. sad to say my job is based on timelines and more timelines so i am no stranger to closing deadlines etc, and this relates to my house. currently i dont have the luxury of time to craft a response to yowetan so that has to wait. i will explain my personal choice in choosing uncle as my contractor and what follows after.

also, just a note, do take some time to read and digest what i said earlier with regards to the flux i was in. i was not pin pointing jason nor uncle for the electrical works gone topsy turvy. turns out that the guy i spoke to was not Ah Tan. it was his worker who told me to get my own switches. when Ah Tan heard it, he immediately apologized to me. I was ok, i understand, no hard feelings. So the problem does not lie directly with Jason nor Uncle, but more of the sub-con. Which i feel may be a prevalent issue with other companies.

Live and let live. I want to eat O Chang Kee chicken wing! But I don't drink coke nor soft drinks, just those canned teas (lemon, peach etc etc)

updates in a bit.

I like the way you see things!!

Jai you aubrey!

[pinkpetter 0]

YAY Aubrey is back fiercer than a lioness! haha

You see... It's worker's mentality. Can't be bothered with service. haiz.

Jia you!! Going to see your update when I get home later!!

[aubrey 0]

oh ivy, i just want to point out, my initial meeting with uncle and the following meeting with uncle when he passed me his quote, i was STILL SKEPTICAL. so i asked him, uncle, whats your edge? why are u able to quote such attractive prices VS IDs?

His reply: Oh.. I can also wear nice-nice, shirt and pressed pants to meet you and quote you high high. Can ar! You want? My edge is cos I take a lot of orders from shops and its in the thousands (sorry my chinese is not good, i dont know which figure is it, but since his main company is GST registered, i gather that it is by the hundred thousands..?) so at the end of the year, those companies will give me rebates of 5% ~ 10% based on what i order hence he is able to pass on some savings to us.

I guess its like Ikea. And 1 thing, uncle's way of dealing is transparent. Which I like a lot.

Edited May 21, 2009 by aubrey

[ivy 0]

Sorry, forget to add on my thoughts for 2 points in yowentan's post so here i go again

However, if you think paying 20K SGD and above as well as playing a supervisory role yourself. I would say it is a very bitter pill to swallow. The experience is very bad for project management really exhuast most of your private time, and most importantly affecting your work indirectly. If you are just paying 10k, I would say you deserve it; however this is not the case. Most of you spent almost 20k minimum with Uncle Soon, and this is the type of service rendered. I can only say busy is not an excuse; however those who decided to go with him despite knowing his tight schedule really deserves a spank.

Frankly $20K will not get u much thing if u enage an ID at most get ur kitchen done with the ID's package (which cost around $10+K)

I am sure with $20K, contractors be it uncle or any other contractors will be able to throw in more things, cos no need to pay for ID's salary or ID firm's profit.

There is still a noticable gap in design knowledge from the professional IDs, however it can be easily offset by the competitive pricing package he offers. However, the level of service rendered is questionable and it is certainly not worth the money.

Uncle is CONTRACTOR not ID. so no design to talk about. We should all know that. May I ask who engage uncle and thought that he can design for you? People who ask me for uncle's contact I will emphasize and re-emphasize about him flying aeroplanes, being late, we, having to do project management and we having to source for own design leh. So i guess this is not a point to judge him. If any home owners need design. pls pls pls pls go to a proper ID firms and don't get contractors, though I must say some contractors can do pretty decent design. But his is just not uncle's strength lor.

[ivy 0]

oh ivy, i just want to point out, my initial meeting with uncle and the following meeting with uncle when he passed me his quote, i was STILL SKEPTICAL. so i asked him, uncle, whats your edge? why are u able to quote such attractive prices VS IDs?

His reply: Oh.. I can also wear nice-nice, shirt and pressed pants to meet you and quote you high high. Can ar! You want? My edge is cos I take a lot of orders from shops and its in the thousands (sorry my chinese is not good, i dont know which figure is it, but since his main company is GST registered, i gather that it is by the hundred thousands..?) so at the end of the year, those companies will give me rebates of 5% ~ 10% based on what i order hence he is able to pass on some savings to us.

I guess its like Ikea. And 1 thing, uncle's way of dealing is transparent. Which I like a lot.

hahaha he so funny. He is also very frank on his profit margin. When I ask for discount he tell me :" ok loh, you tell uncle how much, so long I can earn about $3K-$4K i will do for you. Cos that amount is my 1 month salary." Then I tell him uncle u get 1 month salary from me and then some other more months for the various project wahhh your salary very fat!! then he laugh. hahahah

But coming to think of it, most reno project drag over more than a month so actually for the hours that he put in, ahhh the profit in earn is quite justifiable lah

[growler 0]

Ivy: I agree with you.

As in my blog, i only complained about Uncle's aeroplanes. So far his quality is acceptable to me and my wifey for the price that we're paying.

Our so called contractor/ID we engaged 8yrs ago was around 30k and they gave us crap ... not really worth the money paid ... and we didn't even do the kitchen and toilet floor and wall tiles ! so uncle's pricing to me was the determining factor.

Instead of complaining, I've actually came out with some simple pointers to uncle's prospective customers who need him to give them quotations. I will come out with pointers on various parts of the reno for reference too (after my reno is completed)

[adrian_john 1]

I think we should never be misguided by the assumption that paying a higher price will allow us to be hands-off and still come away happy with what has been done and given by the appointed ID/Project Manager. I think Lawry's case is a very clear example of how high spending is negated by inefficient and sub-standard IDs and the sub-cons.

In any case, I think renovations are very personal things. As individuals, we all have our pre-conceived ideas/concepts of what our perfect home should be like and also how efficient/seamless or trouble-free our renovation process should be. Reality is, renovation requires alot of your own personal committment and ownership on many levels - Ranging from the design process to materials selection, and most importantly the actual construction process. After all, it is your home and what you want or picture in your head, may not be what's churned out by the people you've allocated the job to. And you wouldn't want to be caught in a scenario where you didn't do anything and have to live with what's done when it wasn't what you had specified.

IDs, Contractors, Workers and even us, nobody's perfect. We all make mistakes. Thus, I think when working with different folks, a key ingredient is always chemistry and more importantly alot of compromise, and open mind and heart, and a listening ear. Sometimes, we think we know it all, but sometimes these IDs/Contractors/Workers, can share very vital feedback and also give practical ideas/solutions too. Sometimes this results in us saving costs or not having to live with a mistake. Everybody has their own idiosyncracies and habits (both good and bad), but I think sometimes we have to see things in a bigger picture, moderate our own expectations and also give and take where required, to look more on the good side of things, rather than always harping on the bad (unless the renovation is a total disaster of course).

Another thing about costs, we all know how much the difference can be when comparing hiring and ID and a contractor such as Uncle or Yeak. But to be fair and not hypocritical, we also can't expect that by paying let's say $20K less than an ID to have the exact same sort of services rendered by an ID firm. I mean, to put it in a day-to-day application, I can't expect a normal Mitsubishi Lancer to run like an EVO right? Even if the former could, it'd still mean spending more money on modifications. But sometimes the bright points of these contractors is that they can give us almost the same quality of work churned out by the IDs, just that the trade-off is that we have to make abit more effort on our part to bring it to life. This is where burning leave, spending more time/money and getting frustrated comes in. So in this sense, managing our expectations is important.

From what I've seen, why alot of people choose uncle and are on the overall very happy with him, despite knowing the sort of possible problems they may encounter. I guess they also take into account Uncle's sincere and good-hearted persona, follow-up on quality and rectifications (even though sometimes it is majorly slow) and also the standard and quality of his work. His customers like Pet have also been very nice to return the favour by offering advice and feedback on how he can improve now that he is overwhelmed.

[familyof4 0]

i actually spoke to uncle about the recent happenings. Told him to retain good workers and reject if he is over stretched. He is ever so sincere...what he said touched me, I shared with Ivy before.

He knew we all wanted to build a dream house. It is only a matter of how many dollars we can throw in. If with that amount we have, and he can help us build one close to our dream, he'd rather earn very little and make more people happy, why not?

Frankly, he even intend to close down his factory just to spend more time to manage his projects. He just need some adjustments by the overwhelming works. Give him some time.

We chatted about some uits with problems, he said he will try his best to rectify. Sometimes workers issue also tricky. But workers who doesn't perform, he sack! No second thoughts!

When I decided to meet him initially, I had my reserves too. I was never angry that uncle misses my appointments, I had my fair share too. Just some frustrations sometimes lah. Actually my quote has a difference of more than $10k. Hubby's rationale is, $10K can buy us many things. So we just need to manage a little more. In fact, it was mainly me running up and down.

[asugama 0]

Very interesting to hear different reasons we all engaged Uncle Soon as our contractor... I'm still in the midst of renovation at the moment, and of course we have tasted the famous and big aeroplanes from Uncle.. And something very strange, I don't know how to explain, when Uncle is busy or uncontactable, we will become very nervous and kan cheong.. But once we managed to get hold of him, speak with him on our problems, then our confidence is restored back.. Not that he's a sweet talker or good motivator, but somewhat we have confident with him that if anything goes wrong, he will rectify it for us within his best effort (hope we are not wrong) and when we want to add new things, we are not afraid that the price is over inflated...

This is my first renovation, so I have no experience with IDs at all. But we have travelled islandwide to hunt for best quotation, and the lowest is definitely came from Uncle Soon, and the second lowest is around 5k higher.. and no guarantee that they will do a perfect job as well...