Bachelorette's Pad

[yokine9a 1]

yokine9a - 1 glass panel or entire glass cabinet is the same price? C'mon, gimme a break!

Well, that was what Patrick said to me

BTW, honeygal, about your $2 wall tiles, do you know that the pricing you saw in those tile shops are b4 discount? Someone in this forum ever said that this pricing is a markup price to show walk-in house owners. The actual pricing given to IDs & contractors is at least 20% lower.

[Honeygal 1]

Well, that was what Patrick said to me

BTW, honeygal, about your $2 wall tiles, do you know that the pricing you saw in those tile shops are b4 discount? Someone in this forum ever said that this pricing is a markup price to show walk-in house owners. The actual pricing given to IDs & contractors is at least 20% lower.

now that is awfully depressing to know

[ilmare612 0]

May I ask if $160 psf expensive for a WIW? I am thinking of asking Ho Bee to have it done for me instead of buying from IKEA.

[Pinklady 0]

thanks very much. good thing you only paid $13k! the big ticket items which Ho Bee quoted me are: painting, toilet wall tiles, plumbing works, haulage & debris removal, plastering, hacking and 'making good' this and that. i believe if i had insisted on overlay, my costs would have drastically reduced.

about your glass panel, it seems they apply the same principle to me as well - although i selected the $2 wall tiles, i was still charged as per $3 range. they absolutely, resolutely refused to lower the pricing on this. they were actually ready not to do my biz (because of my constant haggling) and told me so, in no uncertain terms.

As for your selection of the $2 wall tiles, they cfm can reduce the price, this thing i am pretty sure. Becos my ID also told me, if we as the house owner order, no discounts. but if he order, he can get discounts. he's a pretty truthful ID. What's with this Ho Bee people? they machiam eat a lot of money liao, on your wall tiles! You can just tell him nicely that if you do not charge me exactly as per what i have ordered i will definitely put down your co name in Renotalk, and once pple sees your bad image, they cfm wouldn't engage your co for reno. if talks with the person in charge fails, the next choice will be to talk to his boss or his director.

Edited February 4, 2009 by Pinklady

[asianms 0]

seems like Ho Bee has got so much bizness that they can afford to be arrogant. I haven't encountered them personally, but from the sound of things, they seem to have a "take or leave it, I don't need your bizness" kind of attitude.

[yokine9a 1]

Pinklady, the only person we talk to/deal with in Ho Bee is Patrick, & he is also the boss/director/owner. His wife doesn't interfere with pricing & quotation.

asianms, actually Patrick speaks in a humble & friendly manner. But when comes to discount or price lowering, he is very firmed with no rooms for reduction.

Pardon me if I sound very rude, but I have begun to feel that HB is more suitable for people with tons of $$ to throw in for reno & will not bother abt things like $2 or $3 tiles, 1 or 2 glass panels

[ilmare612 0]

Hi Honeygal,

Thank you for sharing with us your reno experience. However, I read with a little 'surprise' on your comments on Ho Bee. Nonetheless, there are a few points which I agree with you but in every case, there will always be two sides of the coins. I am sure you accepted Ho Bee for more then one reason. Besides the fact that he speaks English, I am sure you will agree with me that his workmanship is good. Nothing beats having the assurance that your home is left in the hands of someone reliable. I am sure you will not wish to move in to your new pad and only to discover that the quality of the work falls apart after a short while.

$22K sounds hefty for a 3 room flat but could it be that a older place requires more work? Haulage and debris will contribute to quite a bit for old flats. This, I was told by many IDs whom I have met. In addition, an old flat requires re-wiring work which will also be costly. I read you are laising with many suppliers on your own. Is the 22K purely from Ho Bee or is it accumulative for all? Perhaps you want to share your quotation here with us and we can give some comments?

On the same note, though I agree that Ho Bee can be a little rigid with discounts but as I work on with Patrick, I noted that he can be very accommodating. It's a give and take suitation. As for the cost of the tile, he did give you an option of up to $3 choice but you chose $2. You made that choice. What I know is there will always be a base cost for all work. You have to factor in labour and his other material cost. Why did I say there is always two sides of the coin is because, if you were to change the scenerio round and chose a $3.20 tile. Do you think Patrick will charge you for the difference? Well, I am pretty sure he will not as he is also our contractor. In fact, Patrick even told us that they can get the tiles cheaper then walk-in. That includes our enquiry on a possible reno loan then. Patrick told us all contractors/IDs referral entiles them to a $50 commission even...so he is more then happy if any of his customers take loan. My fiance and I were both shocked at first at his honesty but we know for sure then he was a truely reliable man. This was further proven along the course of our reno and we have not regretted on our choice. Sure, we know we had cheaper alternatives out there, but we only want to have some 'assurance' from the choice we made. We chose that reliability, so we must accept his business style.

Cheer up, I am sure Patrick will ensure that the quality of your work is not being compromise. If we think he is rigid, it could also mean he is a very principled man. Hope I do not sound intruding in any ways. I just wanted to share our views and also to assure you sister You are not alone. As the economy is heading south, it's only natural that we feel sore on those reno expenses.

Edited February 4, 2009 by ilmare612

[xiaodingdang 0]

My new but very old 3rm flat (older than me in fact!) is currently und reno by Ho Bee as well. Sigh... at last count, the damage was $24K.

HB is not cheap, but workmanship so far from what i can see is quite gd. Patrick is also v exp in what he does, and he sets a high std for himself in his work. As a haggled mother of 2 very active boys und 6yrs of age whose maid just ended contract, i m not in a state to really go over reno matters. Eg: there is an ugly slate of black-whatever just outside my kitchen entrance. As i m not redoing the living rm flr, it seems like the fugly thing has to remain. Twice, Patrick asked if i wld like it 'made gd'. How? not in the mind to think, so i kept saying let it be. Today he looked like that fugly thing gotta go. It bothers him that i can be so bochap.

There are many things alr done but not listed in the sales order. So i m not sure if he is charging me or not. But i suspect its foc, or he wld at least warn me first cos i kept murmuring 'burst budget' while talking to him. He asked his worker to build this really solid pc of wall to replace a phoney rotting pc of wood panel disguised as a wall at the kitchen entrance. Cement+support beam now stands where a pathetic pc of wood used to stand. I actually told him just put a pc of plywood in place so that the kitchen entrance can be sealed when the aircon is on in the LR. He laughed and said it will be v ugly. Maybe i am weird. Really cannot be too bothered over such nitty gritty matters.

Will update (if i remember) if the solid wall is FOC. My boys can do whatever they like with the wall now. It WILL NEVER collapse.

[ilmare612 0]

Hi xiaodingdang, yes! You just reminded me another of his virture. Safety and practicality plays a big part in his work. There were times when I wanted something to be done and he warned me of the safety factors. Two thumbs up for that. From the sound of it, I suspect he will not charge you for those stuff too. If no price was ever quoted, what ground has he got to charge you. Hope you enjoy your journey of the reno work

[Honeygal 1]

Pinklady, the only person we talk to/deal with in Ho Bee is Patrick, & he is also the boss/director/owner. His wife doesn't interfere with pricing & quotation.

asianms, actually Patrick speaks in a humble & friendly manner. But when comes to discount or price lowering, he is very firmed with no rooms for reduction.

Pardon me if I sound very rude, but I have begun to feel that HB is more suitable for people with tons of $$ to throw in for reno & will not bother abt things like $2 or $3 tiles, 1 or 2 glass panels

agree agree agree.

my draft reno quotation as follow and there are many things done along the way, eg making good wall where aircon compressor was, removal of 2 aircon units ($120), covering pipes in living room, etc.

Additional reno costs

Carpentry (2 room cabinets, 1 kitchen cabinet, 1 study table, 1 small vanity cabinet: $7100

Electricals $1152

Aluminium works $770

Most work have been completed, so i wonder if there is any more room for negotiation?

[Honeygal 1]

Hi Honeygal,

Thank you for sharing with us your reno experience. However, I read with a little 'surprise' on your comments on Ho Bee. Nonetheless, there are a few points which I agree with you but in every case, there will always be two sides of the coins. I am sure you accepted Ho Bee for more then one reason. Besides the fact that he speaks English, I am sure you will agree with me that his workmanship is good. Nothing beats having the assurance that your home is left in the hands of someone reliable. I am sure you will not wish to move in to your new pad and only to discover that the quality of the work falls apart after a short while.

$22K sounds hefty for a 3 room flat but could it be that a older place requires more work? Haulage and debris will contribute to quite a bit for old flats. This, I was told by many IDs whom I have met. In addition, an old flat requires re-wiring work which will also be costly. I read you are laising with many suppliers on your own. Is the 22K purely from Ho Bee or is it accumulative for all? Perhaps you want to share your quotation here with us and we can give some comments?

On the same note, though I agree that Ho Bee can be a little rigid with discounts but as I work on with Patrick, I noted that he can be very accommodating. It's a give and take suitation. As for the cost of the tile, he did give you an option of up to $3 choice but you chose $2. You made that choice. What I know is there will always be a base cost for all work. You have to factor in labour and his other material cost. Why did I say there is always two sides of the coin is because, if you were to change the scenerio round and chose a $3.20 tile. Do you think Patrick will charge you for the difference? Well, I am pretty sure he will not as he is also our contractor. In fact, Patrick even told us that they can get the tiles cheaper then walk-in. That includes our enquiry on a possible reno loan then. Patrick told us all contractors/IDs referral entiles them to a $50 commission even...so he is more then happy if any of his customers take loan. My fiance and I were both shocked at first at his honesty but we know for sure then he was a truely reliable man. This was further proven along the course of our reno and we have not regretted on our choice. Sure, we know we had cheaper alternatives out there, but we only want to have some 'assurance' from the choice we made. We chose that reliability, so we must accept his business style.

Cheer up, I am sure Patrick will ensure that the quality of your work is not being compromise. If we think he is rigid, it could also mean he is a very principled man. Hope I do not sound intruding in any ways. I just wanted to share our views and also to assure you sister You are not alone. As the economy is heading south, it's only natural that we feel sore on those reno expenses.

i do not doubt his professionalism at all and i have utmost confidence in the quality of his work (although i haven't gone to check yet). i leave everything for him to coordinate with my sub-contractors, and so far so good. he is very organised and reliable, and sure knows his stuff.

i am only sore that a lot of items do seem necessary on hindsight, eg hacking of wall and floor tiles versus overlay. i did not realise that hacking had so much implications (and therefore more costs) on piping works. i am also disappointed that he does not offer FOC for installation of toilet accessories. it costs $60 just to install one water heater!

it was my electrician who highlighted to me that i could have done tile overlay, since 'there is so much height and space left'. he saw the quotation and commented that the pricing is very high. that was when my alarm bells started ringing - although too late then.

My new but very old 3rm flat (older than me in fact!) is currently und reno by Ho Bee as well. Sigh... at last count, the damage was $24K.

HB is not cheap, but workmanship so far from what i can see is quite gd. Patrick is also v exp in what he does, and he sets a high std for himself in his work. As a haggled mother of 2 very active boys und 6yrs of age whose maid just ended contract, i m not in a state to really go over reno matters. Eg: there is an ugly slate of black-whatever just outside my kitchen entrance. As i m not redoing the living rm flr, it seems like the fugly thing has to remain. Twice, Patrick asked if i wld like it 'made gd'. How? not in the mind to think, so i kept saying let it be. Today he looked like that fugly thing gotta go. It bothers him that i can be so bochap.

There are many things alr done but not listed in the sales order. So i m not sure if he is charging me or not. But i suspect its foc, or he wld at least warn me first cos i kept murmuring 'burst budget' while talking to him. He asked his worker to build this really solid pc of wall to replace a phoney rotting pc of wood panel disguised as a wall at the kitchen entrance. Cement+support beam now stands where a pathetic pc of wood used to stand. I actually told him just put a pc of plywood in place so that the kitchen entrance can be sealed when the aircon is on in the LR. He laughed and said it will be v ugly. Maybe i am weird. Really cannot be too bothered over such nitty gritty matters.

Will update (if i remember) if the solid wall is FOC. My boys can do whatever they like with the wall now. It WILL NEVER collapse.

your entry is so funny i guess we both chose him for his reliability. i am extremely busy at work and absolutely have no time to manage all the nitty gritty stuff. so i have to rely alot on his recommendations. i only manage to go check reno at most once a week over the weekend, since i do not have any partner to split such errands with.

i was told tiling would be completed by tomorrow. keeping my fingers crossed that my selection and colour coordination turns out ok!

[applefreak 1]

hmm looking at your quotation

i find the price pretty reasonable leh

as for the overlay part, the original tile condition is very important

patrick might have advised you to hack and relay because he feel that the condition is not too good

it'll be much worse if you overlay and the original tile popped five years down the road

also, haulage is more expensive because yours is not a new flat

for new flat, there's an appointed contractor by HDB/TC so it's a flat rate

for old flat, the contractor got to engage all the necessary container/truck/worker etc thus the higher cost

[ilmare612 0]

Don't look back sister. There will be rainbows ahead of us. As I mentioned on my own thread earlier, most contractors will not give advice or alternatives. We have to be specific in telling them what we want. That's why we did a lot of home work before and during the process. But Patrick will only voice out if your idea is not feasible or impose any dangers along in the long run. Your carpentry, Electricals and Aluminimum works is not done by Ho Bee? Where did you get the referral from?

Edited February 5, 2009 by ilmare612

[Honeygal 1]

hmm looking at your quotation

i find the price pretty reasonable leh

as for the overlay part, the original tile condition is very important

patrick might have advised you to hack and relay because he feel that the condition is not too good

it'll be much worse if you overlay and the original tile popped five years down the road

also, haulage is more expensive because yours is not a new flat

for new flat, there's an appointed contractor by HDB/TC so it's a flat rate

for old flat, the contractor got to engage all the necessary container/truck/worker etc thus the higher cost

the original tiles are 6 years old. i dunno if that is considered old or new?

Don't look back sister. There will be rainbows ahead of us. As I mentioned on my own thread earlier, most contractors will not give advice or alternatives. We have to be specific in telling them what we want. That's why we did a lot of home work before and during the process. But Patrick will only voice out if your idea is not feasible or impose any dangers along in the long run. Your carpentry, Electricals and Aluminimum works is not done by Ho Bee? Where did you get the referral from?

thanks so much for your reassurances. i will make a last ditch attempt to bring down prices when i meet patrick tomorrow. not at all hopeful though.

got electrical contact from this forum. very responsible and nice guy. he issued a $700 receipt without me even paying anything! gosh, he sure trusts me a lot!

got my aluminium contact from my geomancer. i needed special fengshui toilet doors, so apparently this guy had experience in making such doors.

Edited February 6, 2009 by Honeygal

[xiaodingdang 0]

From the sound of it, I suspect he will not charge you for those stuff too. If no price was ever quoted, what ground has he got to charge you. Hope you enjoy your journey of the reno work

wow, thanks! Feels a little better that I m actually getting some freebies from HB! M prepared to pay for the wall though i didn't ask for it. I am such a sucker, contractors can rob me blind. M choosing the more exp laminates for my LR and BR cabinets, and actually feel paiseh! Have to keep telling myself 'don't feel bad! U r paying good money for that!!!! '

yes, am enjoying the journey. Tried to document it but m really too busy. Brought camera but kept forgetting to take the 'Before' photos before everything was hacked away.

So far, a pleasure dealing with Patrick and his petite Mrs Quek.