Thanks for your tips re shoes etc, lady1980 You mean you had to hack a new door into kitchen? Main thing is, was it effective? We just read about this former who used a v good fs man, and struck 4d, this is the kind of stuff that smells like a honey trap, but then again when you hear success stories, it makes you want to benefit in the same way too.... If it helped you pls PM me the fs contact. But I am reluctant to go buy the expensive talismans! On the subject of mr K I am assuming that he must be vvvv busy coz so many ppl here asking for contact As for the start of my Reno journey, I met the guy from woodmac today who does all things timber, and he was v v nice and pleasant, now waiting for their quote.